November 9, 2013

Hush, Hush Discussion

Hush, Hush (Hush, Hush, #1)
Hush, Hush by Becca Fitzpatrick
Series: Hush, Hush, #1
Source: Gifted
Publisher: Simon and Schuster
Publication Date: October 13, 2009
A SACRED OATH
A FALLEN ANGEL
A FORBIDDEN LOVE

Romance was not part of Nora Grey's plan. She's never been particularly attracted to the boys at her school, no matter how hard her best friend, Vee, pushes them at her. Not until Patch comes along. With his easy smile and eyes that seem to see inside her, Patch draws Nora to him against her better judgment.

But after a series of terrifying encounters, Nora's not sure whom to trust. Patch seems to be everywhere she is and seems to know more about her than her closest friends. She can't decide whether she should fall into his arms or run and hide. And when she tries to seek some answers, she finds herself near a truth that is way more unsettling than anything Patch makes her feel.

For she is right in the middle of an ancient battle between the immortal and those that have fallen - and, when it comes to choosing sides, the wrong choice will cost Nora her life.

Nitzan's Rating:
*Spoilers Abound!*
If you've noticed, there's no "My Thoughts" banner for this - and I'm going to tell you why. Because today is special! Recently, Nitzan from Drugs Called Books read Hush, Hush. And she hated it. She can wax some poetic ranting about this one, that's for sure. But I remembered this one from my pre-blogging years (oh, the joys of nostalgia), so we started to talk about it. I defended certain things that she didn't like, and it's basically become this big inside joke - she finally basically dared me to re-read it. And I did, so now we're going to discuss it! (Say hi, girly!)

Nitzan: Hi girly! Oops, that's not what you meant, is it? 
Hi guys, my name is Nitzan, but don't try to pronounce that. Seriously, you're not going to get that right. Like Megan, I'm a book blogger, And I... suck at these introduction thingys. What do I say? I like chocolate. But that's irrelevant.
This is my first time doing something like this, and I can already tell I'm going to have tons of fun! Let the ranting discussing begin! 

Megan: You know that's not what I meant! -_- Really? Did I get it wrong? Now you got me thinking about how I probably pronounce your name wrong... why you do that?! I like chocolate too... can I have some? Oh, yeah. The discussion thingy. That's what we're supposed to be doing. So I guess I'll start!

You already know that I still liked Hush, Hush, even though you've told me repeatedly that Patch would be bad for me - or anyone. But let's not go that direction.... for very long. I'm going to start with Patch anyway, because I know that's who you're really dying to talk about!

(Don't ask me why I like this book. It's nostalgia, because everything I noted was something that bothered/upset me, except for in a few instances, and yet I still felt love for this book.)

My initial impression (this time) was that Patch is a tremendous douche. It first hit me when he was talking to the teacher in front of the class - and he points out that Nora is toying with her hair, and that means that she must like him. He called her out. In front of everyone. What. A. Jerk. But then... I got over that remarkably quickly. WHAT IS WRONG WITH ME?!

Nitzan: LOL, don't worry Mags, pronouncing my name correctly is practically impossible in English; the language lacks one of the sounds from my name. If it makes you feel any better, I like how you say it :)

As for Patch... sorry, I do NOT know what is wrong with you. I hated, hated, hated that boy. Or whatever he is - considering he's centuries old. And people think Edward's a pedophile... but, I liked Edward. At least he was charming. Patch is about as charming as a bucket of worms. *shudder*

Seriously, the guy does too many bad things to be a good romantic interest--or any romantic interest for that matter-- in my eyes. It would be one thing if he acted like this once in a while... BUT IT'S ALL HE EVER DOES! Not to mention he's got a liking to pushing Nora against walls. Don't know about you, but that's not my dream boyfriend. And I would never, ever want to go with Patch to an amusement park. Just saying. 

By the way, PATCH IS NOT EVEN HIS REAL NAME! or at least, his friend says they nicknamed him "Patch" because they used to patch him up. Whether that's his real heavenly name or not, what the heck is wrong with Nora for not asking any questions relating his real name after that?! 

Megan: That actually does make me feel better. Thank you! :)

GAH again with the nickname thing - I don't know! I didn't question it when I was reading, although I do wonder what his real name is now that you've brought it up. Again. LOL. I don't actually mind the pushing against walls thing in general, but... I don't like it when she tries to get away (think hotel room) and he totally blocks her in and won't let her go - that's kind of scary. You think that you're a tough girl (trust me, I think I'm tough), but I've been in a joking situation like this (where I was trying to take a swing at a certain boy) and he held me back. I couldn't get to him, no matter how hard I tried. So the idea of being held against my will terrifies me. I will not lie, that part totally freaked me out.

That's what makes the idea of rape culture so terrifying - because so often we hear that she must have wanted it, because she didn't fight. But most men are stronger than women... trust me on this. (THIS HAS GONE COMPLETELY OFF-TRACK.) *back on track*

But the awkward part of the hotel room scene was that she was trying to get away from him after she caressed his wing scars. I realize that she saw a terrifying vision (and I have things to say about that), but why doesn't she even try to talk to him? I have to say something about Nora, though... why is it that she never questions anything? She should question Patch when he tells her that he can't control what she sees when she touches his scars - because, hello, he can make you think whatever he wants! That just screams red flag. She never once questions that Dabria Greene must be a good angel... even if she snuck out of Heaven. And why does Patch do everything in his power to make what she said true? "You're going to kill Nora Grey." "Okay, sweetie shorts. I'll do my best to make that happen, with a roller coaster and a knife and other stuff." (So, yes, I totally agree about going to amusement parks with Patch. That won't be happening, thank you very much. Let us avoid knives as well.)

AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO THINKS THAT IS RIDICULOUS. Why would you try to make something like that true? (Phew, I can tell that this is going to be a long post.)

Nitzan: Oh, I don't mind pushing against the wall if she wants and agrees to it (I mean, check out some of the NA genre. It can be quite... *ahem* nice). But she doesn't. If he wasn't incapable of physically feeling, I think the next step would have been actual rape. He doesn't seem to care or feel enough for it to bother him. And yeah... rape culture is a frightening thing. And I agree, we're sidetracking into serious and meaningful conversation - THAT'S NOT WHAT THE READERS CAME HERE FOR! lol - joke. Trying to lighten the mood and all that jazz! 

By the point we got to the whole "I can't control what you see" shit I just didn't freaking care enough to mind her lack of questioning. I mean, she never questions any of Vee's god damn awful plans/ideas. I was not surprised that she just believed him. I have said this once, and I will say it again - Nora is the stupidest "smart person" I've ever read of. She feels threatens - she calls the person who she believes stalks her and possibly have attacked her. I rest my case.

And... yeah. That is utterly ridiculous. Not to mention that apparently he has loved Nora way before he ever talked to her. So by the point all this is happening, there is absolutely no reason for him to try to hurt her. And yet he does, repeatedly. But I never believed he really loved her to begin with. When you love someone, you care and worry for them. You don't try to scare them to death, and if you hear they're being stalked and attacked? You try to do something about it. But he never did. He didn't even acknowledge the fact she has a stalker. That's not love. Or I sure hope as hell it isn't. 

Megan: Haha, I was referencing the NA genre too! LOL.Gah. This conversation is taking an odd turn - but I think it's sweet when he says things like "I feel it in my heart"; although I do not think that rape culture is sweet, nor do I want any such thing to ever happen to anyone I know. Stalking is terrible - and yes, if it was happening to someone I knew... I'd want to stop it.

Which brings me to Vee. I'm really starting to see your point with her - I was totally talking to her in all of my notes, telling her that she was an idiot and why didn't she care for her friend and did she really think that was okay. Case in point - when Elliot comes to Nora's house drunk and physically threatens her (I'm feeling the need to state that it was oddly similar to the Patch + wall scene), Vee says "he was just drunk. Everyone does stupid things when they're drunk, he wouldn't hurt a fly" (that's paraphrased, but you get the point). In all honesty, yes, drinking does make people do things that they normally wouldn't.

But it also makes people weirdly honest and more up front about what they're feeling. He wanted to hurt Nora, so he did. I had an awkward moment with a drunk guy once, and although he didn't remember it, I'm sure that he said what he was thinking at the moment. (He was made to apologize. Aren't Southern folks great? ;)) Liquor makes peoples' tongues (and hands and minds) slippery.


Let's get back to Vee, though. If you knew that your best friend had been physically threatened, wouldn't you try to keep her away from that boy, even if she wanted to be around him? And Nora didn't want to be around him! So what is even the point, Vee? So you can make a play at the clearly disinterested boy that he hangs out with?

That seems terrible. Lets not even mention the ill-fated camping trip. What makes you want to go camping, out in the middle of the woods with two guys you barely know, alone? It would be different if you knew and trusted them. Not to mention the fact that it was Spring Break - you don't think that Elliot isn't going to get drunk and violent on Spring Break? Why are you so trusting? (Nora is pretty trusting as well, but we'll talk about that later.) You went to a party without your best friend, then called her to come pick you up? REALLY?! Don't even get me started on the fact that you would rather give your car to your best friend than drive her home in the fog. BUT when she asks to borrow your car, you tell her no. You give her an ultimatum. That doesn't actually sound like a good idea to me. You call her out (when she's trying to get out of a sticky situation), and you think you have a sense of humor... but Vee... you're really not that funny. Your comment about "watered-down-porn" almost made me puke. It was not funny, nor was it smart.

Also, if you meet someone - whom you go to school with - in the library, that does not mean that they're stalking you. If you think he's a stalker, why do you want Nora to date him, then tell her to stay away from him, he's totally creepy? THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE. WHY ARE YOU SO STUPID? You abandon Nora constantly, and I don't think that you're a good person. This has been a meaningful rant, Vee, but I must now let Nitzan take over.

Nitzan: Please, don't get me started on Vee. I swear reading of that girl traumatized me. You can testify to that, Mags. She is the worst friend I have ever had the displeasure of reading about; she's self centered, ignorant, obnoxious, and I spent most of the book telling her to shut up or I'll kill her. Who needs enemies when you've got her? My only regret is that none of her stupid, careless, self absorbed plans killed her. Especially considering she came awfully close. 

I am also pretty angry with Nora for accepting this behavior. I don't recall Nora ever feeling really hurt, or really fighting against what Vee did. It was all okay; even when she told her she thinks her stalker is there, and Vee proceeded to make the brilliant plan of switching cloths, Nora pointed out he might be armed... then went with it. Vee calls Nora out? Oh, okay. A little annoying, but whateves. Vee protects the drunk guy who tried to hurt you? all forgotten. Vee wants to go camping with them? You say "no way", but you don't really comment on the stupidity. I mean, has she been with Vee so long she doesn't even recognize what an awful human being she is?! Why doesn't she never call her sorry ass on it? or better you - just dump it all together and find a best friend someone can actually stand?!

But that's all I'm going to say about this creature. Because any more than this and I might go search for the potion that will enable me to go into books and proceed into methodically ridding the book world of this monster. Jeez, I'm morbid. Part of my charm?

Megan: Well, fine then. We won't talk about Vee. ;P It is part of your charm - I'm glad that you recognize that! I support your plan to hunt her down.

I thought it was odd that Nora let Vee impersonate her as well. You're being stalked, what do you do? You obviously send your pitbull like friend after your stalker. That sounds like a totally good idea. And from the descriptions of Vee and Nora at the beginning of the book.... a jacket wasn't going to automatically make them think it was Nora. I mean, really. Since when does "curvy", "blonde" and "six foot tall" sound the same as "dark haired", "average height" and "skinny"?

Average height is about 5'6 for a girl, I believe, and Vee's supposed to be somewhere around 5'10 or 5'11. It's obvious when you see someone that tall... they're tall. So that plan was ridiculous to start with! Oh, sorry... I'm talking about Vee.

I'll move to something else. Your alternate favorite character, Patch! *teases* I think that Patch is so cheeky sometimes - I really think that it's adorable! But I remember that you read City of Glass recently? I think of Patch like I think of Sebastian, except I like Patch, and Sebastian just gives me the heebie jeebies. Patch is so mysterious and interesting... but Sebastian freaks me out.

I think that my thing with Patch is that he says some really swoony things sometimes. "I feel it in my heart" etc. My book relationship with him is complicated. I'm constantly back and forth between "I like him" and "he is such a douchebag". I also thought that some of the "romantic" scenes between Patch and Nora were awesome... but when she's scared of him, that freaks me out. It's just a really awkward relationship that I have with this book. I'm so back and forth.

I have to talk about something near the end that relates to Patch and Nora now. The fact that Nora allows Patch to possess her, even just to protect... gives me the shudders something awful. You know how I feel about possession books, and this is right up there with that. The entire idea is so scary. And creepy. I just... can't talk about this! Ugh.

Nitzan: Glad you approve Mags <3 

*snort* Yes, I just love him *dry tone*. In fact, I love him so much that I am going to methodically ignore everything you just said about him and pretend I didn't read it, because for me at least there was absolutely nothing swoon worthy about him. Say I believed some of his "romantic" lines, well, then it might have been better. But I simply don't. We already establish that I don't believe for a minute that he loves her; he constantly forces himself on her, seems to have no regards to her or her well being, says at least one obnoxious thing per page... I quite honestly can't even recall one scene I thought he was decent in. Seriously.

So, let's focus on the end, instead... if you remember, I skipped this bit in my "review" rant because I couldn't face it at the moment. There are just so many things wrong with it. For starters, the whole letting him into her head. Yes, that is way creepy. Possession is bad enough without you basically letting the evil spirit do it (or fallen angel), you know? Plus, in general, how can you love a person who possess you? How do you ever know it's real (WHICH I DON'T BELIEVE IT IS!)

Then, there was the fact Nora practically sacrifices herself for Patch. Why, for god's sake, did she do that? She was sure he was stalking her for 90% of the book - he was just THAT creepy with her. Then, she also hated the things he said to her most of the time. They didn't have a good, honest to god conversation the entire book. Not one. She doesn't know a single personal thing about him - favorite color, how does he like his coffee, favorite food, whatever. Nothing. She can't, under any circumstances, say she knows this person, who HAS TRIED TO KILL HER BEFORE, LIKE A COUPLE OF TIMES. What the F? WHAT THE F?! why would you sacrifice yourself for this person? Why would you worry about him? Why are you in love with him?! Please, just stop! tell me this is a nightmare. Tell me I didn't really read that.

*sigh* alas - I did. I have so much MORE to say about the ending, cause all this is not all that pissed me off, but I think I ought to hand the reins to Mags for a while, so she could say a few things before I go out of control :)

Megan: I'm sorry that you felt the need to ignore my comments about Patch. :P

GAH THE SACRIFICE. That bothers me too - with what's portrayed in this book, what with angels and Heaven, it's obvious that they've got a bit of a Christian background somewhere. Which I happen to be Christian, but I gotta say - if your only options are sacrifice yourself for the dark angel dude or get shot... you get shot. On one hand, you could say it was courageous... but I see that and immediately think "she committed suicide for him, what a moron". I did not like that.

I STILL like the book, though. You're not succeeding, Nitzan! :P

If you think about it, suicide was romanticized for this book. It would have been different if she had jumped in front of a bullet for him or something like that - that would be brave. But throwing yourself from the rafters of a building is just stupid. Not to mention that Patch becomes her guardian angel because he doesn't accept her sacrifice.... what. In all honesty, with the number of times that he's tried to kill her, coupled with his fall from Heaven and then getting accepted again... how does that work? How do they know that he won't kill her now that he's her guardian? THEY DON'T. So, bad call.

I still strangely like him... but as a guardian angel? *shudder*

I really think that we should talk about Nora before this is over. She seems so... innocent. And dense, lets not forget that one. I mean, she's sweet... but like Nitzan said, she's the dumbest "smart" person ever. But I must be pretty dumb too, considering that I like Patch...

The big thing that I don't like about Nora is that she is constantly talking herself out of believing the things that she's seen and felt with her own eyes. The point is, she should trust her instincts more. I am all out of notes now, Nitzan. Your turn! ;)

Nitzan: Nora is just so very stupid. You're not stupid; your only vice is liking Patch (lol) but Nora's isn't. It's being stupid, and clueless, and spineless, and pathetic, and contradictory, and on top of all that liking a guy she thinks the worst off (how does that even work!?) and seriously - WORSE researcher on this plant. Honestly, who reads one lousy article when they're searching something!? Do you have any idea how MANY angel legends are out there?! What makes her think that single, stupid (and inaccurate) page is all true? Even Bella from Twilight knew better, for heaven's sake, and that girl threw herself off a cliff, rode motorcycles and etc to get an adrenaline rash so that she would see illusions of her ex. That's a tough act to pass, but unfortunately Nora does so. Flawlessly. 

(The whole research thing is something that really irked me. Can you tell? I take my research very seriously.)

Oh, and how 'bout we talk about the subject that despite everything we (or I) said, by the end of the book Nora apparently knows Patch so well that she knows that the act of closing the door behind him is done to protect her and separate her from all the bad that happened, like keeping a barrier between them. Nice prose, girl. Now, what drugs did you take and where did you get them, because they seem like a lot of fun, making you say S like that. When, oh when, did Patch give you the impression he would do things like that? But say he would. WHEN HAVE YOU ACTUALLY GLIMPSED IT / TALKED TO HIM FOR REALS TO KNOW IT?! What did I miss?! 

I think I missed something. Maybe my edition had 60 70?80?90?600? How many pages would one need for this? Surely over 1000, if they want to convince me. Possibly more pages missing, where they go on dates and he shows her that deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep down he's a decent guy, who truly cares for her and feels apologetic about pushing her off a roller-coaster. And naturally, thorough those dates she got to know him well enough to recognize the symbolism behind him closing the freaking' door.

Yes, that's it. I think this is what happened. In fact, now that I've thought of it, I'm certain. This must be what happened.

Megan: Not gonna lie, I am suddenly very confused. (LOL, I must have read a different edition!) But Nora's research is very lacking. One article. Just one, and suddenly she's all over it. This doesn't upset me near as much as it upsets you, but if I wanna know something, really know something, I'll probably read more than one article.

I DO NOT KNOW WHAT THIS DOOR THING IS ABOUT. (Never mind. I now know what it is about, and I thought it was a metaphorical door we were talking about... turns out he literally closed the door.) I get the door thing now! But... yeah. Still actually doesn't make sense. O.O

Nitzan: Yep, just literally closed the damn door. 
I think, correct me if I'm wrong, that we covered just about everything we wanted to - Patch's doucheness, check. Vee's title as the worst best friend ever - check, Nora's stupidity - check, Romance - check... yep. 
To sum up - I hated this book. If you haven't gotten that vibe from this post, I have done my job wrong. There was nothing redeeming about any of the characters, in my eyes. But, if there is one thing I did like about this book - it's all the conversations I got out of it between me and Megan *hugs* We all know there is nothing better than a good rant, and I did that (maybe slightly too much. I might be getting somewhat annoying. I'll tune it down from now on, swear)

Any last words, Mags? (not like, before dying last words or anything. Just about the subject) 

Megan: (Jeez, I didn't know we were talking about dying here. O.O) *hugs*

I definitely think that we covered everything! BUT I LIKE IT. SO THERE. *is being immature* I don't know if you guys got the vibe from this post, but... overall, I really like this book. It's one of my favorites from before I started blogging, and it so gives me nostalgia. I love it. I think that Patch can be quite swoony (I can see Nitzan rolling her eyes right now), and that Nora is okay. Not particularly smart or anything, but okay. I have no defense for Vee, though. I hate her just as much as Nitzan does, unfortunately. I hope you guys enjoyed this discussion! :D

16 comments:

  1. LOL! This was so entertaining for me. I especially liked: As for Patch... sorry, I do NOT know what is wrong with you. I hated, hated, hated that boy. Or whatever he is - considering he's centuries old. And people think Edward's a pedophile...

    Ha! I agree.

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  2. Megan@The Book BabeNovember 9, 2013 at 11:30 AM

    Haha, thanks! That was Nitzan. ;P I told you that she doesn't like Patch! Fine guys. *goes off and sulks*

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  3. You too consume way to much sugar..but you certainly make me giggle, and oddly enough I feel the need to read Hush, Hush!!!

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  4. Caffeine and sugar, dear :3
    Glad we made you laugh! Haha, now you want to decide for yourself which side you're on, right? I hope you'll be on Megan's side - it's much better to love a book than hate it (though ranting has it's advantages)

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  5. My, thank you! I think that was one of my better lines, myself.


    <3

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  6. I hated that book. Nora is on my scale level of the worst possible female protagonist ever. It goes like:
    Bella (Twilight) - Nora (Hush,Hush)-Gemma(Gemma Doyle Trilogy)-Talia (Uglies)-Meghan (Iron Fey).

    In this book I really hated Patch, but later on he improves. The book is just... ugh.
    I want to read Finale though to get closure.

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  7. Megan@The Book BabeNovember 10, 2013 at 7:47 PM

    Haha, thanks! I think. LOL. :P

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  8. Megan@The Book BabeNovember 10, 2013 at 7:48 PM

    OMG YES. Gemma! I'm so glad that you included her - I really didn't like her. I want to read the rest of the series as well. It'll be fun, right? ;P

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  9. I did read books 2 and 3 (three seriously didn't need to exist, I found the entire book unnecessary) and MY GOD Nora just keeps going downhill, Patch actually get better.

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  10. Not sure if that's encouraging or discouraging. LOL

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  11. I actually really enjoyed Hush, Hush. It has its flaws but I just really enjoyed the story for some reason and I do like Patch too! You are not alone Megan!!!

    This was a fun post!

    Teresa @ Readers Live A Thousand Lives

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  12. Megan@The Book BabeNovember 11, 2013 at 7:20 PM

    LOL. I'll really have to read them, Aliaa! :) The idea of three scares me, though. Everyone says that it was terrible. O.O

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  13. Megan@The Book BabeNovember 11, 2013 at 7:21 PM

    YES I'm not alone! I just really enjoyed the story too. It just sucks you in. <3 Thanks! :D

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  14. Hush Hush is a lot like Twilight.Either people love it or they hate it with a passion.I personally gave this book a 4.5 star,because at that time,I was so in love with the concept of fallen angels.
    It was a really funny post by the way:)Great idea!

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  15. Megan@The Book BabeNovember 13, 2013 at 9:24 AM

    Haha, I think that you're right, MIshma. It definitely is like that. :) I actually really like this one too - 3.5 star. That's pretty good, in my book! Thanks, girly!

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  16. It really really was >.<

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